Your GPS in Healthcare: Navigating Medicine, Mindset, and Advocacy

In this episode, Dr. Nicole Rochester shares her remarkable journey from practicing pediatric medicine to becoming a nationally recognized health advocate. Sparked by her experiences caring for her late father, Dr. Rochester realized how vital her medical knowledge and connections were in navigating a broken healthcare system. That realization inspired her to create Your GPS Doc in 2017, where she helps families and patients understand their diagnoses, bridge communication gaps, and make empowered decisions about care.

Over time, her work expanded beyond one-on-one advocacy to training other physicians to do the same. Through her program Navigating Health Advocacy Ready Set Launch, she has guided dozens of physicians in transforming their careers, building advocacy businesses, and addressing mindset barriers that hold them back. She emphasizes that while medical knowledge is critical, learning how to market, price, and build sustainable practices is just as important for long term success.

Dr. Rochester also speaks nationally on critical issues like empathy in healthcare, medical gaslighting, and systemic racism. Her TEDx talk introduced the concept of the “90 second encounter,” showing how small shifts in patient connection can transform trust and outcomes. She continues to advocate for structural accountability in healthcare while helping patients and doctors alike cut through barriers. To learn more about her advocacy work, coaching, and speaking engagements, visit: yourgpsdoc.com

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Transcript:

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Host 

Dr. Nicole Rochester, thank you so much for being on the podcast.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

Thank you for having me, John.

Host 

You are a doctor, you're a pediatrician, and it's always so fascinating to me to talk to physicians who get into the advocacy space. So let's start there, because you have a lot that you do, a lot that you've kind of branched out in within the advocacy space, but let's talk about how it even started.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

Sure. So I am a pediatrician, as you stated, and I was practicing medicine for almost 20 years when I made the transition to health advocacy in 2017. And I didn't do it to run away from medicine. I actually loved my job. I wasn't experiencing burnout. I was looking forward to what I thought was going to be a lifelong career in medicine. But my late father, who had a lot of chronic health conditions,

really became pretty ill in 2010. And my two older sisters and I had to fairly suddenly and abruptly start helping to care for him. And we kind of fumbled around initially trying to figure out who would do what. And then eventually we decided that as the doctor in the family, I would be the one to oversee his medical care. So I started going to his health care appointments and he was in and out of the hospital and the emergency department.

And for three years until he passed away in 2013, I saw the healthcare system from a completely different vantage point. And I was like overwhelmed and disgusted and frustrated and all the things. but what I noticed pretty early on is that my experience and my expertise and background as a physician was a privilege in that caregiving situation and from my dad. And there were so many instances where I found myself.

asking questions that I knew the average lay person wouldn't know to ask, or escalating matters because I knew exactly how hospitals work and I knew who to ask for. And so I saw my dad benefiting from this and wondering what is everyone else doing and understanding that as difficult as it was for our family, I'm a physician, one of my sisters is a nurse, we were still struggling, but also thinking, you know, every time I would navigate some system or some problem,

using my medical knowledge or even frankly, just my, my pool, you know, like my, my, what do you call it? I guess my, yes, my connections exactly. And then I would say, okay, like this went well, but it's only because of my position. What about everybody else who doesn't have a doctor in their families? So before you passed away, I was really starting to think about how I could do this for other people. But as you know, John, like you spend your whole life becoming

Host 

actions.

Right, right.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

a physician and so the idea of leaving medicine was not even on my radar. But a couple of years after my dad passed away, I just really started feeling strongly that there was something else that I was supposed to be doing. And once my friends and colleagues knew about my experience with my dad, they started reaching out to me saying like, hey, now my mom is sick or my dad's in the hospital or my grandmother has this and what did you do? And so people started coming to me over and over again for advice.

and insight. so I just started thinking, okay, what would it look like to do this for other people the way I had done for my dad? And that led to me starting my own business and leaving medicine. And I haven't looked back.

Host 

And when was that? What year was that? Where you left medicine as a practicing pediatrician?

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

That was in 2017. That's when I started Your GPS Doc. And initially I kept my foot in the door. did some moonlighting shifts and things here and there because I really did want to continue to practice medicine. But then eventually as the business took more of my time, I was able to leave medicine altogether.

Host 

So talk to me about what your work as an advocate, just on that part of your world right now, as an actual hands-on advocate, looks like. What population do you work with? Is it 20 hours of your week? Is it 90 hours of your week? Do you do virtual in person? What does it look like? And what kind of advocacy is it? mean, are you doing medical navigation? Are you doing kind of alternative diagnosis options? mean, what's...

what is it that you'd because because of your background as a physician it could be kind of a million things.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

So true, that's very true. I primarily do medical navigation. Now when I first started, like many advocates, I didn't know what I was doing. I I knew what I was doing, but I didn't know what I was doing. I didn't know what I wanted to specialize in. And so I think myself, like a lot of us, we do a little bit of everything. So in addition to medical navigation, I was helping people with their health insurance policies, helping them to understand, helping them to choose health insurance. I did some.

some cases with appeals, insurance denials. Now in 2025, there are people that do that way better than I do. And there are people who have that as their expertise. And so now I really do leverage my medical degree by focusing on medical navigation. And that can look like a lot of things. I really like to help clients and their family members make sure that they have a clear understanding of their medical conditions.

and how to receive appropriate care. I also really like to help them bridge communication gaps. A lot of times when clients come to me, they think that they're receiving inadequate care, but sometimes they're not. Sometimes they're actually receiving great care, particularly when they're in the hospital, but they don't know that because no one's talking to them. They're having a hard time getting all the different players in the room. Their family members are frustrated because when they show up, the doctors have already rounded.

Host 

Right.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

And so sometimes it's really just being that liaison between the client and their family members and the medical team. Sometimes it's walking them through a new diagnosis and helping them to form their medical team. And sometimes it's researching facilities. I have a client now who is hospitalized and is going to need subacute rehab. And so I'm working with her to research subacute rehab facilities based on the unique needs that she has.

So that's what I tend to focus on is helping people understand their diagnosis, helping them navigate the system in which they receive care, giving them tools to ultimately advocate for themselves because I really like to be able to not be needed eventually. I like to give them skills and tools so that once they're through whatever the acute situation may be, they can kind of pick up the helm and do this on their own. And in terms of who I serve,

Because I was a family caregiver myself, and that's still such a huge part of my identity, and that's why I came into advocacy. I love working with family caregivers. I love working with adult children of aging parents and spouses and partners. And also I often end up working with the person, of course, who has the healthcare problem. And the interesting thing is that my client population is almost exclusively older adults.

and those who care for them, even though I'm a pediatrician. So I don't do any pediatric advocacy. All of my advocacy is with adult clients.

Host 

I think that you see that quite a bit in the advocacy space. That's where complex diagnosis comes in. That's where chronic issues start to emerge. That's where, you know, as you age, you have you, you get a punch card and after 10 visits, you get a toaster at the doctor. know, you're there, you're there quite a bit. So it makes sense, makes sense. and, and is your work mostly virtual? Are you actually going to the hospitals? Do you serve people all over the country? What's it look like?

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

I'm located in Maryland, but even in the beginning, long before COVID, I was doing most of my services virtually. I think that's one of the many things that I love about health advocacy is that I can serve clients all over the country. I'm not limited by any geographic barriers.

Host 

Yeah, so...

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

So the majority of my work is virtual. For those clients that do live in the DC, Maryland, or Northern Virginia area, I am happy to provide in-person services when needed. But even in those cases, even with local clients, I have found that the majority of the work that we do together can be done virtually.

Host 

great. it's great for everybody because obviously it's a great lifestyle for you, but they don't need to wait for traffic and parking and meet you at a certain location. It's like, let me just call Dr. Nicole. Like, let me just, let's just schedule something. You know, that's a beautiful part of it. I'm sure. Okay. So that's a huge part of your life and business now, but you've branched out of just being an advocate, you know, hands on kind of

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

Yeah.

Host 

boots on the ground or virtually advocate. What else are you doing? Cause you're doing some fascinating stuff on kind of the training side.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

Yeah. So a few years into doing this, I started getting tagged in some of our physician Facebook groups by doctors who wanted to do what I was doing. And the funny thing is even now, I mean, I just spoke to a physician a couple of days ago, there's still a lot of people within the healthcare system and outside of it who don't know that health advocates exist.

And so periodically there'll be a post in one of the groups where a doctor is either frustrated with their job and wants something else, or they may just say, you know, is there like a career where I can just help patients understand their medical conditions and help them navigate the healthcare system? Like they'll literally say it like that. Can you get paid for that? And then now other doctors who know me will say, you need to like Nicole, Nicole Rochester is the person.

So I started getting tagged in these Facebook posts and I had doctors reach out and say like, Hey, how did you do it? And so I would hop on phone calls and zoom calls sometimes for multiple hours. And then as I've gotten busier, I no longer had that capacity. And so then I had a doctor, probably this was like 2020 say, well, can you just coach me? And I was like, no, because I'm not a coach. And so I turned her down. And then I had another doctor a couple of months later say, well, I know you don't have time to.

You know, do this for free. Like I'll pay you. Can you just coach me? And I kept saying, Nope, not a coach. And then finally by 2021, was like, wait, maybe I could be a coach. mean, at that point I had four or five years of experience doing this and had, you know, figured out a lot of things by making mistakes, what I now call lessons. And so initially I just kind of did a couple of one-off coaching sessions with a few doctors and that led to four or five sessions. And then that led to me developing a formal.

program that was still one-on-one that I hardly ever talked about. But if somebody came to me and said, would you do it? I would say yes. And now I have a small group coaching program called Navigating Health Advocacy Ready Set Launch, specifically for physicians who want to launch a successful health advocacy business. So we just started our eighth cohort two days ago, and I've taken about 34 physicians through the program. And it's been amazing to

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

to be able to transfer this knowledge and to be able to accelerate the path. Because for me, it took me a long time to really figure out not how to do advocacy, but how to make it a successful business and how to properly price my services and all the things. And so now I'm able to pass that on to other physicians and with the hopes that they will avoid some of the challenges and some of the mistakes that I made and have a more straightforward.

Host 

Right.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

path to success and more importantly to impact and to helping clients.

Host 

Yeah, I think that's it's so interesting that you're focusing on physicians, not just because obviously you're that's your background, but they they know the medical part, right? They they know the navigation. They just maybe they need to know some of the boundaries because it's different as a doctor than it is. Yeah, so so there's some boundaries they have to kind of respect. But again, that's I think that's kind of the quick and easy part that you can probably or the I shouldn't say quick and easy quicker and easier part.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

Definitely.

Host 

for a physician, but you're probably spending a lot of time, like you said, on pricing, marketing, positioning, how to actually build the business, build the reputation so that they have something that has legs and can move, is that right?

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

That is right. Yeah, there's a lot of, you know, tactical strategic information and guidance in the coaching program. But interestingly, John, the majority, mean, that, that stuff, you know, that's in the modules, they have videos, they can go back and watch that over and over again. What we spend a lot of time on is mindset. And I, I think when I began coaching, I started to really unpack and uncover all of the mindset shifts that I had to make.

in order to be successful because as a physician, and this is probably true for many other professions, but I can speak to physicians. One, we're not taught how to run businesses and that's probably by design, but that's another conversation. And so we're taught to just kind of, you know, be the cog in the wheel and follow the rules. And so as talented and as brilliant as we can be, we have mindset blocks around being successful and being able to go out on our own. So you'd be surprised.

how much I talk about just this idea of like, you can do this, you know, because a lot of physicians, they've done so many hard things. They've literally saved lives, but they come into the program with a lot of doubts about whether they can be a successful business owner. And so we talk a lot about kind of some of the things like perfectionism and wanting to always be in control and not wanting to make mistakes and having a low tolerance for risk.

Those are things that are important in the medical field when you're an actual clinician, but those are the very things that can trip you up when you are running a business. You have to put yourself out there. You have to be willing to make mistakes and learn from those mistakes and pivot. So we spent a lot of time in the program on mindset as well. And then like you said, the boundaries, because we are not practicing medicine. We're flipping from being the doctor to being the consultant.

And so we talk a lot and I get very specific scenarios. We do some role playing so that they can understand what that looks like to show up as someone who happens to be a doctor, but you're not their doctor.

Host 

Right from patients to clients. It's a whole different kind of ball game. How long is your coaching program typically?

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

That's right.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

It's an eight week program and it's a combination of asynchronous like videos and downloadable resources. And then we have live coaching calls every week to do a deeper dive and answer questions. And then the thing I love the most, one of the many things I love about it is that we have a community for alumni. So we have a Facebook group and other ways that we stay connected. And so we share resources. I'm watching them shine and they get their first client and they have questions.

So we're building this community of physician advocates, which has been really great.

Host 

Sure.

Host 

It's amazing because we need more physicians in the advocacy space for sure. And it is, it's, mean, as you're kind of proof here, evidence that it's a, it can be successful and fulfilling and kind of check the boxes that so many doctors, especially ones who are burned out, really want to kind of check off and eight weeks. I mean, it sounds like what the coaching program really does is it, it takes the three or four years that it took you and condenses it into two months.

And so you're just kind of cutting the line with the program.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

That's exactly right.

Yes, that you, you were, need to put that in some of my marketing cup. That's great, John. Yes. Cutting the line.

Host 

Yeah, okay great. Yeah, I hope more people hear about it. You also have done some speaking and I think that that's one thing that I wish that hospitals and kind of the systemic issues that are existing in the healthcare system would look to other advocates to do more of in non, you know, listen, we have some great conventions and conferences for advocacy, but I'd love to see it because there just aren't enough people who know what advocacy still is. It's still this emerging kind of nomenclature.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

Thank you.

Host 

Talk to me about the speaking. saw you did a TED talk and you've done other speaking as well. How did you get into that? What do you typically speak on? And how has that impacted you and the people around you?

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

Well, got into, I've been a speaker probably since I was like, I don't know, five. I'm the person that used to get in trouble for speaking in class for talking. Who knew that, you know, that meant I was going to be a speaker one day. So, so, I mean, I'm joking, but I'm actually being really serious. Like I, that's like the one I could not get an A in behavior because of my, talking. But,

Host 

Hahaha!

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

The only time I couldn't get an A. But in terms of speaking, I guess more formally, as when I was practicing medicine as a pediatrician, my last role and a couple of roles prior to that was in academic medicine. So in addition to taking care of patients, I had the pleasure of teaching medical students and pediatric residents. So I did a lot of speaking in that context. There were talks that I prepared to teach the students and the residents and sometimes even nurses.

about different medical conditions and some of the things that we experience in pediatrics. So I think I kind of caught the bug for speaking in that capacity. But in terms of my advocacy work, when I first started Your GPS Doc, I was very concerned about the fact that there are a lot of people who need this information who will never be able to afford an advocate. And so I really wanted to figure out how can I

get this information to the people who can't pay me to work with them privately. And so I started speaking in libraries and churches and community organizations, at caregiver conferences and things like that, just talking about how to navigate the healthcare system, how to navigate it as a caregiver, how to navigate it as a patient. So those were kind of the early speaking days. And then I've continued to do some speaking around that.

In 2020, after the death of George Floyd and all of the other deaths and just kind of the whole unrest in our country, I started giving talks about structural racism and bias in healthcare and had a lot of opportunities to talk in hospitals and healthcare systems and pharmaceutical organizations about how that shows up in our healthcare systems. And that really kind of catapulted me into

a lot more speaking engagements. So I continue to talk about that. I talk about medical gas lighting. I share about my caregiving experience. And I continue to talk about navigating the healthcare system. I talk about restoring empathy in healthcare, which is incredibly important to me. And that was the crux of my TEDx talk. So my TEDx talk, I had the opportunity to share about

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

my experiences caring for my late father as a physician who, you I understand the challenges that clinicians and, you know, the healthcare administrators, I get it. Like I understand that side of it. And I'm also, or I was a caregiver. And so being able to provide that perspective and what it boiled down to for me was feeling like there was a lack of empathy.

in our healthcare system. And so the big idea for my TEDx talk was something I introduced as the 90 second encounter, which is this idea that the first 90 seconds of every clinical encounter will be spent just talking. Like you and I are talking, like before you come in the room with your laptop or whatever and say, hey, you know, what are you here for John? Or what can I do for you today? It's like, how do we connect on a human level?

And the idea is that when you truly connect with patients and when they are able to connect with you, it transforms that relationship. It builds trust. There are studies that show that it leads to improved adherence to the treatment recommendations, the medications, all the things that we physicians tell our patients to do and then get frustrated when sometimes they don't do it. So yeah, so I had a chance to really introduce that concept. And so I continue to talk about that. I've done workshops.

where we spend 45 minutes to an hour actually practicing the 90 second encounter and doing role play. And that's always a lot of fun to have pharmacists and physicians and nurses pretend to be the patient and see what it's like on the other side of things. so yeah, speaking has become a big part of, of what I do at your GPS doc. And it's, it's, it's a nice balance to the advocacy work and the coaching as well.

Host 

I get a good sense of what the empathy and the 90 second kind of connection is. anybody who's gone to just even a regular physical and has 15 minutes with their doctor can, I think, appreciate what 90 seconds of dedicated eye contact quality time of what's going on with you can really do. But you blew past a bit of a Pandora's box. So I'm going to go back a second.

racism in the healthcare system. Talk to me more about how that shows up. Cause there are people, especially ones who are struggling with navigating their own or loved ones, healthcare issue that might be facing this might not be understanding what it is or why it's coming up. Talk to me about what, what you've discovered and how you educate people.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

Thank you. appreciate the opportunity to share about that in more detail. know, we know that there are health disparities. I like to use the term health inequities because when you talk about a disparity, it's just saying there's a difference. So we know that as an example, black women are three times more likely to die from childbirth compared to their white counterparts. And that's regardless of income, regardless of socioeconomic status, education, and those statistics are

evident in any, I mean, if look at any disease, any type of cancer, heart disease, anything, black individuals, and in general, people of color have worse outcomes. And so the fallacy is that some would look at that and say, that's because, and then insert, you they're this, they're that, they don't do this, they don't take care of themselves. But what we know is that at the root of really all health inequities is bias and discrimination and racism. And when I say racism,

It's important to note, I'm not talking about like the doctor is racist or the nurse is racist. I'm talking about more structural things. So access to care that differs based on where you live. And those things are built into, you know, policies and laws that predate me and you. So there are a lot of things that are part of our literal like system, the healthcare system and all other systems, educational systems that really continue to create barriers.

for people who look like me. And so what that does is that leads to worse health outcomes. But then there also is bias. And so we know that all of us, literally every human has biases. We've all been exposed to stereotypes. We've all been exposed to information about groups of people that may or may not be true. And without always knowing it, that lives in our subconscious. And so there are lots of studies that show

that, again, black patients, Latina patients, patients of color, are not treated the same. The conversations are different. The length of the conversations are different. They're sometimes not offered treatments, clinical trials, and even other basic therapies. When we look at protocols that are established for certain conditions that are even in the medical record, like algorithms and things that should go seamlessly,

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

We see that black patients and patients of color often are not receiving treatment. There's a study that shows that black patients who have had a stroke spend more time sitting in the waiting room of emergency departments before they're seen. I mean, I could go on and on and on, even in pediatrics. There's a study that shows that in pediatric patients who have appendicitis, which could be a medical emergency, they are less likely to be given appropriate pain medicine.

compared to white children. So like, these are babies, these are kids, I'm saying babies, but so it even trickles down to the treatment of children in healthcare. So my talks really are not meant to blame or shame or make anyone feel badly. It's really to illuminate the problem and then to present solutions. And so I talk about on an individual level, we all have a responsibility to examine our biases and to regularly be thinking as we're engaging with patients.

Is there something I'm thinking about this person? Is there some belief that I have that might interfere with my ability to deliver the best care that I can? So that's like on the individual level. And then on the systemic level, are there policies that are in place that are disproportionately burdening patients with lower socioeconomic status or patients who have less resources? So just as a quick example of that, a lot of doctors' offices have policies

that state that if you are more than 15 minutes late that you have to reschedule. And sometimes they even charge you for the visit. Now that sounds like, you know, I get it, right? Like they need to be able to move along. They want patients to take the appointment seriously. So I get why those are in place. But if you think about the fact that people who have lower income don't have a car, like it's easy for me to get in my car and fight traffic and get to a doctor's appointment. But if I'm taking two buses and then walking six blocks,

it's more likely that I'm going to be late and I have no control over whether that bus comes on time. If that bus is 10 minutes late, guess what? I'm going to be more than 15 minutes late for my appointment. And so when we look at policies like that, we can see that they disproportionately burden a patient population who doesn't have access to transportation. So it's really like doing those types of deep dives and then trying to understand like, how do we fix it? How do we address those problems so that everybody

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

has the best care possible.

Host 

Have you thought, I'm sure you've thought, I don't know why I asked, I'm sure you've thought of different possible solutions to many of those issues. I'm just curious if there's a high leverage one that you've kind of said if this one thing would change, it would actually make a big difference. Or do you feel like it's too complicated to just point to one thing to do first?

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

Yeah, really think it's too, I, it's not, know, complicated may not be the right word. I think that's the, I'm going to say excuse that a lot of health systems use. And I'm not saying it's easy, but in some ways it is simple because this has been studied, you know, again, for decades. And we have examples of organizations and hospitals and health systems who are getting it right. But, so I can't point to one thing, but I think the thing that

would be the most profound is to really have a systematic way of examining policies and really figuring out are they impacting all of our patients the same? Are there elements of this policy that in and of itself may seem fair that would cause a certain patient population to be disproportionately negatively impacted? And if we did that with every decision,

that we made and with every policy. I think that that would go a long way in starting to eliminate some of these inequities. And then the other thing is really accountability. I mean, it's not okay that year after year after year, I talk about statistics that show consistently, you know, these vast differences in the way certain patient populations are treated, the way the care that they're receiving, the outcomes. And then, you know, with just the next year, another statistic pops up and then we say it again,

And so there's a lack of accountability for those types of outcomes. And so I do think weaving that in somehow is important for us to really see change.

Host 

Okay, does that bleed over into some of the gas lighting, the medical gas lighting as well?

Dr. Nicole Rochester (29:24.2)

Absolutely. Yeah, women are more likely to be gas experienced gaslighting. People of color are more likely to experience gaslighting. People in the LGBTQ plus community are more likely to experience gaslighting. And a lot of that also, again, comes with these usually unconscious biases. And so, you know, if you are if you are not a minoritized

Host 

Let's let's do a specific example so people understand. I know what it means, you know, but let's like you're in the doctor's office. Maybe you have a pain and how how does that you know you can pick a symptom you know, but you know it walked me through what that might look like.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

Yeah.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

Yes.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

Sure. So let's, let's go with pain since you mentioned that, cause that's one of the big ones. So let's say, you know, if you, and these are generalizations, I don't want anybody listening to get, you know, upset, but these, mean, they're generalizations, but they're also what we see in the literature. And so, for pain, if you are a black male as an example, and you go to your doctor or you go to the emergency department or to urgent care complaining of pain, you are more likely to be perceived as a

quote unquote drug seeker. And you're more likely to be perceived as someone who is requesting pain medicine. You're addicted, you're trying to work the system. And so those pain complaints are often minimized. And we see that with, again, with black people, with Latino people. So that's something that is very common. If you are obese, so there's biases against people who are overweight and have obesity.

Host 

Mm-hmm.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

So with those conditions, any single problem that they complain about often is attributed to their weight. And so they can say, have a headache. you need to lose more weight. I have this, I have that. And people in my own family have experienced this and I have friends and even clients who have experienced this where they had significant issues, but instead of investigating their complaint,

the medical provider automatically, they see this person who has overweight, obesity, and they go, this is, you just need to lose some more weight. And so there's a reluctance to even investigate a person's complaints or sometimes their complaints are minimized. mean, that's really at the crux of medical gaslighting is minimizing someone's concerns about their own body.

Host 

What is that for patients who might be listening or potential patients? What does that sound like out of the mouth of a physician? What does it minimize it like?

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

yeah, minimizing could be, you know, I come to the doctor and I say, I'm having a, I'm having headaches and they're getting worse and I'm really concerned. And then maybe they ask a couple of questions, maybe they don't. And they say something like, well, you're probably stressed out. You know, you probably just need to, or they may ask a question to say like, well, what's your stress level like? And then, you know, I have four kids and I just saw so much, it's because of your stress. And again, not even per.

pursuing, sometimes not even an examination to see, maybe stress, stress is like, that should be the last resort. Like you should do an examination. You should ask more questions. So, you know, minimizing would be kind of attributing it to something else without doing a thorough examination, without doing testing that, you know, another patient who maybe looks differently would get a more thorough workup. So that's, that's one example. And sometimes it's literally

ignoring, you know, I mean, it's literally kind of, or always assuming that it's the least severe problem. And again, you know, we were taught in medical school that this idea of like horses versus zebra, zebra meaning something rare. And so we're taught to kind of put people in boxes and to listen for these context clues and then to say, yeah, you have this and this, you probably have that. So that in and of itself is not necessarily gaslighting, but when

certain populations of people are treated that way, know, systemically, and they're more likely to be dismissed as opposed to having their concerns at least listened to and maybe even evaluated.

Host 

Sure. Sure. Fascinating. mean, all, and all of it happens within a 10 minute span that the doctor might see the patient. It's so, it's so fascinating. Well, if someone wants to work with you, let's talk about both potential clients for advocacy and how they, how they'll find you as well as physicians who might be interested in cutting the line and taking your coaching program. How do they, how do they find you?

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

Yeah.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

The best way to find me is on my website, which is your GPS doc.com. That's where you can find information about my advocacy work for clients who may want advocates or advocacy services for physicians. There's a button on there for coaching. So there's a physician who wants to learn more about the coaching program. And then there's also for speaking and consulting. So everything I do is on the your GPS doc.com website.

Host 

Amazing. Dr. Nicole Rochester, thank you so much for being with us.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

Thank you for having me. This was a great conversation.

Host 

Yeah, I agree. All right, I'm going to stop the recording.

Dr. Nicole Rochester 

you